Trigun 2/2

We pick up where we left off about Wolfwood’s most iconic scene, and conclude with the core differences between Vash and Knives as Hero and Antagonist respectively. Also, which version is better, Trigun 1998 or Trigun Stampede? And why do people name their kids after utensils anyway??

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:00

Hi, welcome to the Tail Trail. I'm your host, Sharon. Also go by Sherrows 49 online, and this is my little brother Lyndon.

SPEAKER_00 0:07

How's it going?

SPEAKER_06 0:08

On this podcast we talk about stories. Stories in any form are welcome here. How's that for a new intro? A little more streamlined than before?

SPEAKER_02 0:17

I think so.

SPEAKER_06 0:18

Alright, well we're back at the We're still talking about Trigon. Part two. We're ha part two for the Trigon.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Part 2.5 is something you said or something.

SPEAKER_06 0:27

I wrote Yeah, 2.5 because this is like episode 2, but then like it's the second half of episode 2. Alright, where did we where did we actually leave off?

SPEAKER_00 0:37

It was all over the place last time, so.

SPEAKER_06 0:39

We were talking about Legato and Wolfwood in particular.

SPEAKER_00 0:44

Mm-hmm. I think that's where we left off, those two characters.

SPEAKER_06 0:47

Yeah, so regarding Wolfwood, I think we were talking about how he like he's your favorite character. And we were talking about uh his death and why he's so different in the original. But I didn't fully get into how different he is in Stampede, other than having a very different personality and a different worldview. But I wrote a note here that says, Go back to Wolfwood briefly to discuss the significance of his cross weapon, which ironically does represent mercy in the end. So we mentioned that Trigan is full of cross imagery, right? The main cross though is Wolfwood's weapon called the Punisher, which it looks like a giant cross.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

Such a cool weapon.

SPEAKER_06 1:27

Yeah. Well he keeps it all wrapped up. And a joke in the old one is that whenever he like hands it to someone, they're like surprised at how heavy it is, because they think it's just like for a show, guess he's a priest. And they're like, this is so heavy, what's in it?

SPEAKER_00 1:42

That's because it's so full of mercy.

SPEAKER_06 1:44

And that's what Wolfwood always responds. He says, That, my friend, is because it's so full of mercy, but we know in actuality it's full of lead and missiles and other weapons, literally. It's like a rocket launcher in the ball.

SPEAKER_00 1:59

It's like his to-go bag of like warfare.

SPEAKER_06 2:02

It's like a rocket launcher in itself and a machine gun, and then he has like smaller pistols inside of his well, at least in the old one. He like pulls some like regular pistols out of it and like hands them out, I think. I can't remember. I know what that was when he was like, ah, bang, bang, bang, bang. Um, but it's it's funny because I feel like in the end it kind of is full of mercy because when he dies, uh we said that scene was really iconic, but we kind of forgot to say why. He sort of drags himself to a church while he's bleeding out and is asking for forgiveness, and thinking about his life and the people he cares about and how if he could do it over again he would have liked to do everything differently. And smokes one last cigarette.

SPEAKER_02 2:44

My favorite scene.

SPEAKER_06 2:45

He dies holding on to that cross, like clinging to it and leaning against it, and I like to think that he was shown mercy in the end. Like in that scene, the cross doesn't isn't really a weapon anymore. The cross is a place of refuge, which I really love. And then after after that, Vash takes well actually Millie takes Wolfwood's cross and gives it to Vash, which he uses in the final fight to actually defeat knives. So it's sort of like Wolfwood kind of lives on through that cross. Uh Vash even hears Wolfwood telling him what to do, kind of like imagining what he would say in that situation. And it's no It's really beautiful. I just wanted to mention the significance of that cross. I thought it was really cool. It sort of represents Wolfwood, it represents Mercy, and it is a weapon, but it's a lot more than that, and I like it a lot. Oh, I have an one other note about Wolfwood. He is an important character. Uh one last notable difference in Stampede's Wolfwood is Wolfwood's completely different backstory. There is no chapel. Chapel was like his mentor in the old one, that really freaky looking guy.

SPEAKER_00 3:54

Chapel. Chapel, and he's always holding an apple.

SPEAKER_06 3:59

No, his chapel is in like a little church.

SPEAKER_00 4:01

I know I know.

SPEAKER_06 4:02

Oh, because he's always holding an apple. Yes. Well, the apple was like this weird shticky head, but then he was like teleporting himself in different coffins, which I think is the most vampire-coated ability.

SPEAKER_00 4:14

It it's one of the most silly abilities I've ever seen in a TV show, and it made me laugh when he first did it. I was like, bro, what is it? He definitely laughed.

SPEAKER_06 4:21

But I also it makes me think like, is he a vampire or what?

SPEAKER_02 4:24

Maybe.

SPEAKER_06 4:26

I don't know why he would have that ability otherwise. It's just so weird. So in the new one though, uh Wolfoot doesn't buy his own orphanage. He doesn't really have like his own orphanage that he starts. He is from an orphanage.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

And then he just has a thing for orphanages.

SPEAKER_06 4:45

No, he wants to take care of that specific orphanage because those people are his family, but the Eye of Michael is this super messed up cult, like they act like it's a church. But if that's a church, then I'm a monkey's uncle, because that's that's the most diabolical evil organization ever. They take Wolfwood when he's a kid, and another one of the boys, Livio, and they experiment on them, and the experiments make them grow into adults really quickly. So I think technically Livio and Wolfood are like twelve years old, but they're walking around as adults now. So I don't know if if they're supposed to be like have the maturity of kids, because they don't seem like it. But yeah, that's very weird and messed up. Another difference that is actually I think a really nice one in Stampede is that Wolfwood and Livio are brothers. Not literally, but they love each other like brothers, and Livio becomes Livio the Double Fang, who has like these two mini punisher crosses, and Wolfwood tries to get through to him, but he's like this robot, like he doesn't act like a human anymore. And then Wolfwood is able to get him to remember because of how close they were, but remembering everything just makes him lose it even more because of how horrible everything was. So he kind of like tries to off himself, but of course it doesn't work because Livio has regeneration abilities like that are even more refined than Wolfwood's. So of course that wasn't gonna work, and the bad guys pick him up again, and Livio has a split personality. What do you call it? Like DID?

SPEAKER_00 6:29

I think so, something like that.

SPEAKER_06 6:30

Disassociate identity disorder, I think.

SPEAKER_00 6:33

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 6:34

So when Livio dissociates, he becomes Raslow, who is like this really psychic Raslo the tribe punisher. So instead of two punishers, he's got three, and he's got a third arm growing out of his back, which is mega gross. So Livio is a character who is in the manga, but he's not in the original anime, but he is in Stampede and Stargate. And I do really like the lengths that Wolfwood goes to rescue Livio slash Raslo to the point of him almost dying, just to get through to him in the vain hope that his brother will come back to his senses. There's this really cool scene, this is only in Stargaze. Well, actually, it's in the manga too, where it's a really good character design for one thing. Half of Livio's face is like tattooed or something. When he goes crazy and he's Raslo, he's got like really spiky hair on the one side too.

SPEAKER_00 7:24

He looks like he's part of some kind of band or something.

SPEAKER_06 7:27

Yeah, he lo he definitely looks like he's part of some edgy band. Like a a weird like kiss band or something. But Livio it's like Livio suddenly takes control of himself for the first time. Livio's voice starts talking to Raslo, even though they're the same person. And when Livio is talking, we go to the one side of his face that's like clean, that doesn't have the tattoo. And then when Raslo is talking back in the different sort of voice, we go to that tattooed side and back and forth. So it's like a conversation between two people, even though it's legal and it is, it's a lot like that Gollum scene actually, and I like that scene because he's like, You've taken care of me. Like you, it's because of you that I survived, but I don't need you anymore. And he's like, What are you doing? You need me, stop! And he's like, No, like it's time to decommission you, like I'm going to take control of my life now. Wow, that's a lot like me going on that. Cool. That is a lot like Gollum. I did not think of that. I was actually thinking of one of the I want to say it was one of the band of seven in Inuyasha who had the ID as well, who was like a really kind doctor or a killer, and that was really sad, because he's both. But yeah, I I don't know if I just like characters with DID, but I thought that was kind of a fascinating scene. It was just well done. And I like Livio and Wolfwood as brothers. I think that's really sweet.

SPEAKER_00 8:47

Yeah, it adds a little bit of tenderness in that edgy.

SPEAKER_06 8:50

That edgy version of Wolfwood, yes. Ah, one of my biggest complaints about Stampede is next on the list, uh, Merrill and Millie. So why don't you start Lennon? Like, why are they so different in the new one? Like what or what was so good about them in the old one?

SPEAKER_00 9:06

They were heavily involved in the uh original TV show, just much more present, like directly involved with the plot, and just much more interesting characters, and obviously more funny in my case.

SPEAKER_06 9:20

They were super funny and minor detail, I way prefer their designs.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

Yeah, no, I would say I prefer their designs.

SPEAKER_06 9:26

I don't know what they're wearing in the new one, especially Meryl, like I mean it's not bad. It's like a cute outfit, but it's like so it's too cute. Like a like a beret and like shorts over leggings or something. She almost seems like chucks or I don't know what she's wearing on her feet. I don't know what she's going for there, but in It's cute, but it doesn't look like Merrill at all, and maybe part of that is because the new one is not it's not as much of a western as the old one.

SPEAKER_00 9:50

Yeah, which is something actually I didn't really like about the new one is that it wasn't didn't feel as much like a Western.

SPEAKER_06 9:57

It leans heavy into the sci-fi, and it is a sci-fi. It's a space western, but it's way less of a western. Meryl in particular looks a lot younger. I feel like they were starting to build up to Merrill being more mature and more independent in Stampede after Roberto dies and she's going to take Millie on as like a new trainee. But in Stampede, I feel like Millie and Merrill are totally not in Stampede, sorry, in Stargase, Millie and Merrill are totally they're even more sidelined. Way more sidelined than they were in Stampede, and Millie isn't even in Stampede.

SPEAKER_00 10:32

Let's make you not really control the plot here a little bit and just like Well, not even close.

SPEAKER_06 10:37

Like they could have been written out, I think, in Stargase anyway.

SPEAKER_00 10:41

I mean, however, in Stampede, what's your name again? Merrill. Merrill, uh, she does like help Trigon get out of that, like Did you just call Vash Trigon? Oh my goodness. In my head, in my head when I think of Tri like Vash, like, oh, it's Trigon, you know? Yeah, well my bad.

SPEAKER_06 11:00

Vash Vash Trigon, I guess, because he's got the three guns, technically. Right. I think even though I thought it was because of the crosses, because like a cross has like three points, but Trigun is technically called Trigun because Vash has a gun, and then he has a gun in his arm, and then he has the angel arm. So three guns. If the angel arm counts as a gun, although it does look like a cannon, it's Pampede.

SPEAKER_00 11:22

It's a gun of sorts, but kind of. But uh, where was I getting it? Yeah, and then Vash.

SPEAKER_06 11:27

Meryl Merrill saves Vash.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

Yeah, Vash snaps out of it.

SPEAKER_06 11:30

If Merrill didn't save Vash at the end of Stampede, then the world would be doomed. So we owe Meryl a lot for that. Someone pointed out to me that that scene is a little bit like Mary finding Jesus in the tomb. But you could say that. I think that might be a little bit more of a reach, but um, I appreciate that Merrill didn't back down ever in Stampede. Uh, but she already had that personality in the old one. I think she's still really brave and has that personality in Starge, but like the plot doesn't really know what to do with her. I'm not quite sure what the problem is, but Meryl and Millie are in very few fights. They it's like they're always present, but they don't have much to do. And they're journalists instead of insurance agents, and I think that's much less funny, to be honest, because I thought it was really funny that they're insurance agents who are chasing Vash around because he's a liability.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

We're gonna talk about your car's extended warrant.

SPEAKER_06 12:24

They don't usually talk about insurance. Well, sometimes they do, they're like talking about at the beginning, they're like, yeah. In that one movie, they really talk about insurance of that one statue. But yeah, like they are actually insurance agents, and I think even though it's silly, it's way funnier. Obviously, they go above and beyond as insurance agents. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 12:44

Did you just say funnier? Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 12:47

It's more funny, okay. But I don't know of any insurance company that would like send agents to like monitor a situation 24-7 because of how bad that particular area is or something. Like in in the old show, Marilyn Milley are sent to find Vash the Stampede and like work with him to sort of get him to stop being so dangerous because he's like I think they're just they absolutely fail at, I'm sorry. Well, that ends up not being the point in the end, because then they're invested and they actually care about it.

SPEAKER_00 13:21

Well, I'm just saying they suck at their job, alright?

SPEAKER_06 13:24

Actually, I'd say they're very good at their job in that they're the only ones willing to put their necks on the line. That's true. And when they go back to the office, everyone's like, Why do you even do that? Like, why does it matter? That's like so stupid. And I'm like, well, they've got the to do it.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

I know. They've got the gulf.

SPEAKER_06 13:40

So they're kind of like better than all of you, even though maybe they have less numbers to show. I guess you're right, but they're brave. You gotta give them that. They're committed, and maybe they kind of use that as a cover because they actually care about bash, but let me tell you, uh, the taller lady. Millie.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

Yeah, Millie, she can fling some what do you call it? She can fling some metal, I'll say that. She can sling that gatling.

SPEAKER_06 14:03

Millie is so precious. She is the giantess of this show, and she might just be taller than everyone.

SPEAKER_02 14:11

It's crazy. She's so tall in the original.

SPEAKER_06 14:13

She gives off such like homeschooler farm girl vibes, and apparently she has a very big family. I think they are farmers. Uh so she's like very sweet and naive. Um, she doesn't carry lethal weapons like Meryl does. By the way, in Stampede, Meryl only uses a tiny gun like once. And then Millie, I think Millie does use her stun gun at some points in the new one, but not very much. And she doesn't have that big dress that she hides it under, which was really funny.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

It's like a trench coat thing, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 14:43

Yeah, that big trench coat, which also just makes her look bigger. But she's already big, very broad-shouldered. But Merrill had like her white coat, when she opens it, it's like, yeah, a drug dealer's got like a whole coat lined with goods. Her whole coat is lined with derangers.

SPEAKER_02 15:01

Derringers just like.

SPEAKER_06 15:02

And she is nicknamed Derringer Merrill because of this, and Millie is Stun Gun Millie. Those nicknames never come up in the new one. Again, because like Merrill and Millie don't really matter that much in the new one, which I hate because they're so awesome. They had so much personality, I think. Cause like what other shows do you see characters like Meryl and Millie who are just storming around and taking charge of the situation? And like it's like they have no business being there, and yet they still command a situation. I don't know what you want to call it, but there are so many people around them who are like not doing anything.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

Like in the old one when sometimes I say they're doing more than Wolfwood. Sometimes they are. They absolutely are. Well, Wolf was just procrastinating a lot during the episodes.

SPEAKER_06 15:45

It's just like Wolfwood has issues. Sometimes he's doing stuff, sometimes he isn't. He doesn't really want to. I feel like these girls kick her boys into gear quite a bit, including Vash. Even Vash uh sometimes could be more involved than he is. Yeah, Merrill is a lot tougher in the old one because she actually uses she's called Derringer Merrill, she uses her guns. She for example, this one scene in the old one where everyone the whole town has gone berserk because they're trying to kill Vash to get the bounty, and it's completely disorganized to the point that the mayor even hired criminals without thinking about how much damage they would do to the town.

SPEAKER_03 16:20

Mm-hmm. That part was hilarious.

SPEAKER_06 16:22

It's absolute chaos, and the mayor is just like, oh no, I didn't think this through. The mayor is so funny, he's hilarious. And then Merrill comes and takes a megaphone, she's like, I need to speak to the man in charge, and they're all like, We're a little busy now, and she's puts a megaphone in his face. Like, I will speak to the man in charge. Doesn't she basically like kind of fix that situation? Or she at least so enraged that she was like, she berates the mayor for his lack of foresight. Like, you didn't think something bad would happen?

SPEAKER_03 16:53

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 16:53

And he's like, at the moment at the time it really seemed like a good idea. That whole episode is so chaotic, I recommend that one. I forget which episode is that. Episode five?

SPEAKER_00 17:04

Yeah, I feel like it's somewhere.

SPEAKER_06 17:05

That's episode five because the Nebraska family are in it. I think it's episode five. And there's this run and gag with Millie and her stun gun. Uh, she keeps it under her skirt so that people don't know that she's armed. And then when they go to like bars and stuff, some of the men are like being kind of inappropriate, and Millie doesn't really care, but then the strap of her stun gun breaks, and then it falls on the toe of one of the guys. So she unintentionally like makes them back off, but then it's even worse, and she's like, Oh, I'm so sorry, this stupid sling is always breaking, and then she picks it up with one arm. She picks this massive gatler up with one arm in front of all these guys, and then they back off because they're like thinking that she's actually just pretending to be naive and she's actually gonna get them, but they're also like, How is she this drunk? And she was never gonna hurt anybody, she's just like, Oh, silly me, like like and actually means it because she doesn't really want to hurt anyone unless they are actually trying to kill you. Yeah, I really like Merrill and how she never gives up on Vash. It's kind of in both versions, but particularly in the old version. Uh, she always goes after him, including when he tells them not to get involved with him ever again, essentially because he doesn't want them to get hurt, but she does she sees that he's like gonna maybe go go past the deep end or something. And even Millie is like, if you don't see him ever again, or if you don't follow him now, there's a good chance you won't see him ever again. And and they both are like committed at this point. It's like it's no longer their job anymore. They're like, We started this thing and we're in it.

SPEAKER_00 18:43

And we're gonna finish it.

SPEAKER_06 18:44

We're in it till the end, and I know Vash is very grateful at the end, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_04 18:49

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06 18:50

Oh, one other thing. Meryl kind of becomes Rem at two points. Once in Stampede and once in the original. So Rem being Vash's mother figure who taught him uh not to take human life. After Vash kills Logato in the old one, Merrill uh Meryl is trying to comfort him, but he won't listen. But then some townspeople like drag Vash out. Uh I don't remember well, it was for one of the typical reasons, like this guy is responsible for destroying uh this town, which is kind of true. And they're like, We we need to kill him before he does anything else. And she's like, But he hasn't done anything to you. He's just trying to recover. Like, why are you doing this? Please just let him leave him alone. And but she actually, uh realizing how important that uh what do you call it? Realizing how important that ideology was to Vash, or maybe not ideology, but that message that Rem taught him. She realizes how important it is in that it doesn't matter how logical it it is to kill someone, he in his eyes he still sinned. So she sort of takes up the mantle of being Rem for Vash in that scenario and she goes to everyone and says, You don't have the right to no one has the right to take a life of another. And she kind of spreads her arms and and tries to like peacefully resolve everything, and she kind of freaks everyone out to the point where she's able to take their guns away. And Vash sees Rem when she's doing this, and and after that he realizes that even though he made a mistake, or in his eyes he made a mistake, that he can still change because Rem also taught him that people have the ability to change and he can go back to trying to be that person again, and Merrill's the one who showed him that, so he's kind of like losing it, but hugging her too hard and stuff. He's a little maybe a little bit delirious on that part, but and then in Stampede, when Knives has Vash in that tank and he's like extracting his memories and like I can't remember exactly what he was doing, because he was using Vash Vash's power to like make all the plants independent plants or something. And so he was like messing with Vash's memories and stuff, and the Vash was starting to turn near my brain. No, Vash is starting to turn into what looked like a carbon statue or something. But Meryl comes and she's like shooting the the bulletproof glass and like screaming at him to to remember and to wake up and No, you know what?

SPEAKER_00 21:21

I just realized Vash woke up because of how annoyed he was of her voice.

SPEAKER_06 21:25

No, actually, he didn't even know it was Meryl. In his mind it was Rem talking to him, but we know it was Meryl. And then when he wakes up, he's like, Thank you. You saved me. So there was a couple points where Merrill is very significant in particular in bringing him back from the brink or reminding him of who he is. And that's really important, but they don't really have any room for Merrill. Very little room for Meryl in the new one. If they do in the last two episodes, that remains to be seen, because those are the only episodes I haven't quite seen yet. But yeah, I still think it's too late for them to totally redeem that.

unknown 22:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 22:04

That's unfortunate. Merrill and Millie were really sidelined in favor of very plot heavy, complicated sci-fi stuff and a bunch of other characters. And there are way less characters in the old one, so I think that's why Meryl and Millie were so prominent. But I prefer that. But I could go on and on.

SPEAKER_02 22:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 22:21

It's alright. It basically what I'm saying is Meryl and Millie. Oh! Well, here's another reason why Meryl and Millie are so good. Merrill and Millie are really funny in the old one, and their dynamic combined with Vash and Wolfwood is super funny and really enduring and kind of part of why chemistry. It's part of why you get attached to the show, but that chemistry isn't really there in the new one because Merrill doesn't talk to Vash, isn't around Vash nearly as much. Maybe in the first part of Stampede she is, but not in the later seasons. And Stampede as a whole. The tone is just not very funny most of the time.

SPEAKER_00 22:56

Yeah, it's more edgy, dark, and serious. Which not isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it often can be too heavy.

SPEAKER_06 23:06

I think you were saying it's kind of a trend for when they do like modern remakes of something to make it more edgy and serious.

SPEAKER_00 23:14

Yeah, common trait.

SPEAKER_06 23:15

And I'm not a huge fan of that either. I think it's okay for things to be a little bit lighthearted sometimes, because that doesn't mean it's not serious. The original trigon is still very serious, it's just Let me tell you something.

SPEAKER_02 23:28

Later on on the TV show it gets serious.

SPEAKER_06 23:31

Yeah, but it's also lighthearted and funny at a lot of moments, and it has time to breathe. The pacing isn't so breakneck fast. Now granted the pacing is probably too slow on the old one at first, but Yeah, I think there is a happy medium where you can have both, where it doesn't have to be like things non-stop happening, or things are always like super serious. I think people can still take it seriously if it's funny too.

SPEAKER_03 23:54

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06 23:55

Alright, where are we here? Discuss why Vash and Knives turned out so differently despite being raised in the same environment. I had a theory about that, but what do you think, Lyndon?

SPEAKER_00 24:06

Why you mean why they have so uh such different viewpoints when they were raised?

SPEAKER_06 24:11

They were pretty much raised in the same environment.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

Raised the same environment.

SPEAKER_06 24:14

Raised by the same person.

SPEAKER_00 24:16

Again, it has to do with uh obviously individual minds, they take things differently. But I would say that Knives sees it as what they're doing to the plants and like but he considers the plants their uh family, like siblings. So when he sees them doing this, bra raised up in that environment, he uh more more or less develops this sense of rage. Well, I mean, not necessarily rage, like uh frustration against humans, and it sort of boils up into this hatred eventually. Which I guess kind of roughly sums up his thing. And he reads a lot of Bible and then he quotes it and it gets me upset.

SPEAKER_06 24:56

He reads all the worst parts of the Bible.

SPEAKER_00 24:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 24:59

And ignores all the the better parts, like like the parts that are about peace and love and and the fruit, I don't know, fruits of the spirit or something, and he's just we were watching um episode 11 of Stampede today, and he was just spewing like Bible reference after Bible reference after Bible reference, but it was all like horrible stuff like Armageddon or or like Lost Wife.

SPEAKER_01 25:22

I know, it's like where'd you pull that way?

SPEAKER_06 25:26

And it's like those are really I don't want to say they're really obscure, but they're more obscure parts of the Bible, but instead of the parts that everyone else talks about, it's like ah let's talk about genocide and and like and floods and I don't know, divine distraction. It's just like the is that the only part you read, but I don't know. I guess he had a fascination with those.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Yeah. And then yeah, like that's him, and then Vash, he tries to see the good in most of the stuff they were raised in. He's more happy about stuff, more outgoing it seems, and obviously he has a closer relationship with um Rem. Rem. Which I don't want to say that Knives was jealous of that. He just didn't quite understand it as much as Vash did.

SPEAKER_06 26:13

I don't think Knives was jealous of that. I think Knives saw them as being kind of childish and cringy. And he was a bit more uncomfortable with that. Like when Rem goes in to hug him, it's kinda like, eh, stop, you know. And that's there totally are kids like that, and that's not bad. But it didn't help that he keeps rejecting her further when he really needs her, I think. You see that a little bit in the new one, and then uh in the old one as well, like with the infamous apple scene where Rem is cutting Vash's hair, and I can't remember why, maybe there was like an apple tree, but there's an apple in the frame. And she makes it the iconic like standing up hairdo, and and he loves it, he's so happy. But knives is watching this, and then he goes off by himself and cuts his own haircut. He cuts his own hair, but it's really like the scene has this dark vibe, like the the lighting is dark, and he's like glaring at the mirror and he's cutting his own hair, and it's like who cares if you cut your own hair in itself? But there's something there's something symbolic about this haircut where he's like, I don't want Rem to cut my hair. I want to decide who I am, and it's gonna have nothing to do with her. And when Vash comes in the room, he's kind of startled because Nigel's already cut his hair, and he's like, Oh, don't worry, I I I took care of it. I think it's better this way, and they're all like, Well, yeah, it does look like it suits you, but that you see the apple on the ground and it has a bite taken out of it. A bite out of it. So obviously that kind of calls back to Adam and Eve when Adam and Eve decided that they were going to eat the fruit anyway. They basically went their own way and they made a choice that they thought was good for them instead of what God said was good for them. Uh that's dooming all of humanity and and all that jazz, but uh of course knives is the one who causes the fall of man, a la the ships crashing. There's a difference there. I have one little note to say before I go into my theory of why they're so different. Rem seems like a really good person, but who the heck names a kid knives?

SPEAKER_00 28:20

Uh yeah, that's actually a good question. What kind of a name is that? I feel like she didn't have anything to do with the name of Kevin.

SPEAKER_06 28:26

Did he name himself because he Or did someone else name him? Or who named them?

SPEAKER_00 28:31

Like Yeah, that's a good question. We'll have to f find a way to figure that out.

SPEAKER_06 28:36

In the new one, it's kind of cringy that, like, okay, he was called Nye instead of knives because they were like, oh let's be more realistic and give him a real name. But then later he's like, I am power. I am oh I'm not Nye anymore, I'm one millions knives, and it's kind of like bruh, like that is such a teenage emo thing. And not the guy. Then again, he might have even been a teenager at that point, but it's so cringy that they have to like explain it. But at the same time, in the old one, like he was just always called knives. Like, like why? Why don't you just call him like like meat cleaver or or microwave or some random thing? Like I know, it's like it's almost like the name kind of like prophesies him being bad.

SPEAKER_03 29:20

Almost, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 29:21

It's sort of like, hey, uh note to parents who may be listening: don't name your kid Jezebel or Delilah or something, just because that that can't be a good sign. What the heck is that?

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Uh look it up, kid.

SPEAKER_06 29:35

Okay, fine. Don't call me kid, I'm a decade older than you. But my theory why Vash and Knives are so different is that Vash turns his pain inward and knives turns it outward.

SPEAKER_00 29:46

That's basically what I was getting at.

SPEAKER_06 29:48

Yeah, and you're you're not wrong, although maybe you had a more roundabout way of saying it. And you're right that it also was because Vash was much more influenced by Rem. Vash like clung to Rem and listened to everything she said. He took it to heart. Knives did not. He wasn't really sure about what Rem was saying, he was dubious of it. And it's pretty healthy to question things, but I don't think what Knives or Vash does is healthy early on.

SPEAKER_00 30:13

Both ways.

SPEAKER_06 30:14

In the right, so I'm gonna reference a part of the manga in particular because this doesn't it's not this dark in any of the other versions. Uh, but you know when they find the remains of their sister Tesla?

SPEAKER_03 30:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 30:26

In the manga they each react differently. Knives, of course, this starts his whole hatred of humanity thing, and he hates people for what they did, and he is absolutely kind of valid for that. Because that's a horrific thing to do. And of course I think it makes him trust Ram less as well, because she knew about this and she didn't tell them. And Vash actually tries to kill himself. That didn't happen in the new one or the old one, because Tesla isn't in the old one. But they didn't go that far.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

What's her name?

SPEAKER_06 31:01

Her name is actually Tesla, and that's I'm sure this is long before this is long before Elon Musk.

SPEAKER_02 31:07

Okay, please. Elon Musk.

SPEAKER_06 31:10

This is long before any of that was a thing. And they just kept the name. So this Tesla existed before.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

No wonder why it was torn into pieces.

SPEAKER_06 31:17

Oh, please. I knew something I knew this was gonna come up at some point. I just knew it. It was gonna be. It was inevitable. Okay. But Vash turns his pain inward in that he would rather blame himself than anyone else for everything, because he doesn't he doesn't want to direct that pain or that anger towards anyone, because he doesn't want to hurt anyone, which is beautiful, but it's horrible for him because he kind of maybe hates himself. Like uh in the old one too, you see like when Millie and Merrill see him without a shirt for the first time. At first it's kind of funny because like they accidentally walk in on him and it's like, ah, we're so sorry, but his body is covered in like scars, and he's even got these like metal p like uh stitches or something. Yeah, literally to like cover up chunks of probably uh exposed flesh, but And part of that is because like Jesus, he's like, You can hurt me, you can do whatever you want, and I'll still love you, I'll still want to save you. But on the other hand, it's also like I deserve this. In an early episode of Stampede, Vash kinda doesn't ha show a lot of emotion to the horrible thing that just happened in the town because knives came to the town looking for him, and he killed a bunch of people.

SPEAKER_04 32:35

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 32:35

So he turns and walks away after everything is done, because he needs to go find knives. But Merrill is like, How can you just walk away after that after what just happened here? And she's angry it's because it seems like he doesn't care.

SPEAKER_00 32:48

She doesn't understand.

SPEAKER_06 32:49

It seems like he doesn't care, but he's he just says, Because I don't deserve to cry.

SPEAKER_00 32:54

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 32:54

I don't deserve to grieve, like I just all I should be able to do is stop this guy. But he doesn't deserve to like feel pain or feel angry.

SPEAKER_00 33:05

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 33:06

Unless it's towards himself. It's it's weird and it's very, very sad.

SPEAKER_00 33:10

Mm-hmm. Almost seems that they both like when when they react to seeing the uh sister from that uh point you were making. It almost seems like they react the simplest ways opposite to each other.

SPEAKER_06 33:23

Exactly. It's simple and completely opposite, and both are very understandable.

SPEAKER_05 33:28

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06 33:28

Both are toxic.

SPEAKER_05 33:30

Yes.

SPEAKER_06 33:30

Although one is like self-destructive and the other is like destructive. It's everyone else's problem. It's just destructive outwardly. Well, I think it probably destroys knives' soul as well, but in a different way, because he will never he will never allow himself to be accountable. And another thing that I think makes Vash and Knives so different is that Knives is a huge hypocrite. He keeps saying that Vash is a huge hypocrite, and maybe he is in some ways, because like maybe his pacifism causes more people to die. That's the argument. But you can't say that he doesn't that he intends for people to die, he's always going to save people, even at very dear cost to himself.

SPEAKER_04 34:10

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 34:11

But then Knives is like, you're such a huge hypocrite, and yet he in one sentence he says he loves his brother, he does this these things for his brother, and yet he's tormenting his brother all throughout the series and enjoying it.

SPEAKER_01 34:24

Mr.

SPEAKER_06 34:26

And he even goes against his own principles because he wants to save the plants, and then he at least in Stargate's he uses the plants to save himself. To repair his body, and that even confuses his like men. Well, actually, first it was them doing it, I think.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

But then when he saw that they were doing it, he went even further and they were like he's losing his original morals, and then he's just he lost his own plot.

SPEAKER_06 34:55

So he will he wants to save the plants, but he'll also use the plants if he has to to complete his goal. So again, he's like humans are so horrible because they use plants to survive. It's like, well, what are you doing? That's literally what you just did. So, yeah, I would like to say, screw you, knives, over here. I like raise my glass and this goes out to knives. That's right. Screw you. I hope you die.

SPEAKER_03 35:27

Wow.

SPEAKER_06 35:28

Um, then again, I did like how he got readin' in the manga, but I don't know if that's gonna happen in Starge. I guess I will find out. But um regarding Vash, there was one other moment that kind of that kind of shows this. You remember when Wolfwood killed Zazie? He he went and saw Vash and he kind of I think he expected Vash to still be angry with him. I don't think Vash ever was angry with him. But he's expecting Vash to be angry with him, and Vash just looks at him so sadly, and later Wolfwood says, He looked at me as if he had killed a tree.

SPEAKER_01 35:59

Yeah, the trigger.

SPEAKER_06 36:00

And he's like, Don't look at me like that. I'll take the blame, I'll do anything. But don't look at me like that. Be angry, do something, be normal.

SPEAKER_02 36:07

Isn't he threatening him with like his like cross-cutting?

SPEAKER_06 36:11

What is wrong with the tries to like like get him to react? Pressure him to react. It's it's touching in a weird way. It's part of what makes Vash such a emotionally impacting character or impactful, sorry. But it's also a little bit toxic in that it can be it can devolve into like self-loathing. Vash for his flaws, you can't say that he does not love people with his entire being. Literally. So yeah, I think that about covers some of the differences between Vash and Knives. And why Vash is a good guy, and knives is just not, even if he's right about some things. So is there something wrong with how he's going about it 100%?

SPEAKER_00 36:54

Even even if knives is right, he's wrong.

SPEAKER_06 36:57

There's a wrong way to do the right thing. A very, very wrong way. Alright. I think we've about reached our conclusion here. And my note about it says, Why is Trigun so impactful? i.e., why is it so good or so moving? And which version is better and why? You wanna start this one, Lyndon?

SPEAKER_02 37:21

Oof, that's a lot.

SPEAKER_06 37:22

Like, why is Trigun why how has Trigon impacted you personally? I know you made a cosplay of it.

SPEAKER_00 37:29

I know, yeah. That was fun. Uh yeah, the original TV show is just It has a special place in my heart just because I think it was the first anime that I officially finished.

SPEAKER_06 37:41

Oh, you finished it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:43

Yeah, and I re I really, really loved it. Um just how funny it was, how you could interact with the characters, and obviously uh how it portrays uh lots of biblical uh aspects of it.

SPEAKER_05 37:58

Allegories.

SPEAKER_00 37:59

Yeah, allegories, stuff like that. So yeah, I really liked it. Um it the pacing was really good, like much better than the uh Trigon and Stargate.

SPEAKER_05 38:09

Yeah, I think it's way too fast.

SPEAKER_00 38:11

Uh yeah, too fast anyone, but yeah, if we're comparing the two, yeah, the first one's my pick for sure.

SPEAKER_06 38:17

What's the main reason why the old one is better?

SPEAKER_00 38:21

Um how could I put this in words? Um, I'm trying to think of something like deep, just like uh Well I don't know if it has to be deep. It probably is, but Wo would you say it's fair to say that at least the majority of that TV show sums up to the message being forgiveness?

SPEAKER_06 38:43

Try again?

SPEAKER_00 38:45

Uh the original.

SPEAKER_06 38:46

That's possible. Why do you think it sums that up?

SPEAKER_00 38:50

Cause well, cause a lot of the characters in the TV sh uh in the original, their story arcs end on a forgiveness note, in a way.

SPEAKER_06 39:00

Do you mean like Wolfwood even?

SPEAKER_00 39:01

Wolfwood more so, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 39:03

You think he forgives Chapel or something?

SPEAKER_00 39:06

Oh yeah, I think uh in that that one scene he's for he's obviously asking for forgiveness.

SPEAKER_06 39:11

He he forgives him I think he has to forgive himself. He's asking for his own forgiveness. I don't know if he's forgiving other people. He just realizes that he was wrong. Yeah, no, I never said he was forgiven. But he doesn't hate people anymore.

SPEAKER_00 39:21

But he doesn't hate people anymore. He uh is repenting and is asking for forgiveness, and it's a in that particular scene is one of my favorite scenes, probably of all time.

SPEAKER_06 39:32

Uh well mine too, actually.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

It it's super impactful, so that scene, probably in particular, is a really good reason why I love it so much. It was really impactful.

SPEAKER_06 39:42

So without that scene, would you still think the old one is better? Probably. Oh yeah, definitely. So that's again, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:48

Yeah, it has to do with certain aspects. Like the f the new one, not nearly as funny again.

SPEAKER_04 39:53

That's a good one.

SPEAKER_00 39:54

Some of the characters are just not even there. I know.

SPEAKER_04 39:58

Million barrel.

SPEAKER_00 39:59

Again, so yeah, I'd say the main reason why I why I like the old one better is that it just had more. That's what I would say.

SPEAKER_06 40:08

I would almost say it has less. But that's a good thing. It's a minimalist.

SPEAKER_00 40:14

I mean it had more as in it had more of everything. The new one.

SPEAKER_06 40:18

More depth and more characterization. But the new s new one is like crammed full of characters and things happening. Too much in another way, yeah. So it's too much. So when you have more, you almost have less of what actually matters sometimes. Overcrowded movies are a thing. Or in this case a series, but that's a pretty good answer. That's a good answer. Yeah. I almost you said you want to sum up the show saying that's about forgiveness.

SPEAKER_00 40:45

I almost want to say it's a very At least Wolfwood's Wolfwood's um um storyline.

SPEAKER_06 40:51

Yeah, yeah, you could say that. I would almost sum up Trigan in being about redemption, or maybe what Vash says. Vash says this world is made of love and peace, and it's like this cheesy one-liner that everyone's like, oh brother. No, it's hard. It's not he's right. Like the sh he goes to insane, inhuman lengths to live at peace with everyone. And I mean everyone.

SPEAKER_00 41:21

Yeah, no, you're right. I would probably sum it up like you're saying.

SPEAKER_06 41:24

And why? Because he loves everyone. So love and peace is Vash. Like if Vash is uh is anything, he's love and peace. You know how they say that God is love, Vash is love and peace. Because he's a pacifist to a fault, and he loves people to his own detriment.

SPEAKER_00 41:43

Okay, there, there, that's probably another reason why I love just uh Triagan as like a storyline, is because it portrays that so well in a character and in a new way.

SPEAKER_06 41:54

I think it would be really easy to depict someone like that in a laughable way that you couldn't take seriously, and yet somehow you do. Vash is a character who is really hard not to love. If an edgelord like Wolfwood can even love him and admit he's infectious, then I mean that's a pretty good example of why it's so hard to ignore, like it's so shocking, but even if you don't agree with him or something, or if you think that's ridiculous, it sticks with you. You can't forget it. It's unforgettable the way Rash treats people. It's just not not the way people usually treat each other.

SPEAKER_03 42:32

Mm-hmm. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06 42:33

And you could say it's dumb or you could say it's foolish. But I think God's love looks foolish to humans anyway. So it's supposed to be foolish, and yet it's it's not the fool the kind of foolishness you dismiss. You you can't look away from it. There's something so beautiful about it. So for me, how Trigon has impacted me is maybe similar to you. I think I watched it and I first watched Stampede actually, and I thought it was really fascinating, but I didn't love it until I watched the old one, and then the whole thing started making more sense to me, especially as an allegory. And just again, talking a bit more about Vash as a character, it it really gets me every time because I don't think you see that too often to that level. I think you do sometimes in anime, like I think Tanjiro in Demon Slayer is a bit like this, uh, like kind to uh Falms in a in a yeah, in a very beautiful way, like where he like prays for the monster that just you know tried to kill him. Although the huge difference is that Tanjiro actually does kill people. But or demons anyway. But demons used to be people in Demon Slayer.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

Come on, knives is practically a demon.

SPEAKER_06 43:50

Yeah, Tantra would kill knives, but Bash won't. Um another character who's a bit like that is Shy in the Shy series. Uh it's a It's actually not about it's it the name is weird because that's her superhero name for some reason. But just having like almost like fighting the bad guys with love is it's something that seems like it would never work and is really stupid, and yet in these stories it actually is amazing to watch. It is so moving, and if you don't if you're not rooting for that person, it's like you don't have a heart because that is they are so they're so wonderful, they're wonderful people, and they're not wimps either. Like there's there's a backbone to what they're saying. They're not just being all wishy-washy like oh love and peace is great. No, they can back that up with their whole lives, with who they are, and with their actions, to the point where, yeah, they'll take it. They'll take the worst beating imaginable and and then still be able to say something kind about the person inflicting the beating. Another thing I wanted to say about Vash is that he is often accused of forcing his ideals onto people, onto other people in the show. But I think this is not true. Like Wolfwood accuses him of this, I think maybe Knives accuses him of this, but people are always like, Oh, spare me your shiny ideals and whatnot. I think Vash pleads with people, but he never forces them to do what he would do. He does not force them physically. He he implores them to do things differently. Uh one of a couple of examples, um, in the old series in particular. There was an episode where this uh this woman goes to I think she goes to kill it turns out her father was was a bad person and she was gonna she was gonna kill him for what he did. Or actually she was gonna kill the the guy who was like his advisor or something, like the sheriff. She was gonna kill him and Vash just looks at her and he doesn't tell her not to do it, or maybe he does, but I don't think he tells her not to do it, no. But he looks at her and then she goes she goes to pull the trigger and she does, but she shoots to maim him instead. And I think she did that because Vash had that impact on her. But that was her own choice. And there's another episode where this father, and I mean I do not do not blame him at all, but he goes to extreme lengths by like working with I think working with a gang or with bandits to Oh I remember this episode on the sand steamer to like kill the guy so that he could get close enough to the guy who killed his daughter and so that he can make him pay with his life. But when Vash sees what this guy's gonna do, he begs the guy not to do it. But then he listens to why this guy wants to kill him, and of course, like that's that's a horrible story, like it makes perfect sense why he wants to kill him. So Vash doesn't go over there and force the gun out of his hand. Vash prostrates himself on his hands and knees saying, like, I'm begging you don't do this. And the father who ha who is like so rightfully angry, all of a sudden feels like this isn't what his daughter would want. And he's he's like, Why why can't I do it? Why can't I do it?

SPEAKER_00 47:17

Is this the episode where where uh they're in that giant that sand steamer and then like Vash is singing like that song Total Slaughter Uh I Won't Leave a Single Man Alive.

SPEAKER_06 47:30

Genu side bloody daddy died, an ocean of blood. It's it's such a ridiculous song. Now keep even though Vash is the one singing it, he would never commit genocide. But he does play up the I the image that he has because everyone thinks he's this crazy murderer, and sometimes he uses it to his advantage and pretends like he's about to shoot up the town just to clear the town for their own safety. So sometimes to hype things up, he will intimidate people just because he knows that they're already scared of people.

SPEAKER_00 48:04

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_06 48:04

But it's never actually to kill anyone. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:08

My memory serves me right. I knew it was on that episode.

SPEAKER_06 48:10

I love that episode. It's so funny. And I love just being in the dark and singing that song and freaking everyone out.

SPEAKER_02 48:17

Yeah, one of the guards on the episode, he's like, what is that song? Awful lyrics. Yeah, it's off a lyrics.

SPEAKER_06 48:23

Yeah, it's off like I love the dialogue in the old trigon.

SPEAKER_01 48:28

And another point. The the banter in the background. It's so funny.

SPEAKER_06 48:33

There are background lines that you wouldn't even notice if you weren't paying attention that are super funny. Like, whose idea was it to plant the grenade? They can't turn him in for the reward if he's a pile of pulp, you dumb it! And that was in the background, and someone like like brought the audio louder on like this edit I saw on YouTube. And I just to emphasize it, but I think I did remember that when I actually saw it. But I love all those. There are so many good lines in Trigun. If you go to this video on YouTube that's called 18 Minutes of Trigon being a quote unquote quality anime. Now it does make fun of some of the maybe some of the animation errors in it, or some of the like awkward moments in the series, and it also shows some of the really funny dialogue, like almost all of it, in that video, and you'll see why Trigon is so endearing to us, because it's so memorable and so easy to quote, and so like you could say a line from Trigon that you probably wouldn't find anywhere else, like, Oh, I'm so glad you asked. It's a long story, although it's kind of a short one.

SPEAKER_02 49:40

So good. Who says that again at Vulcan? I knew it. I knew it was Vulcan. Doesn't he say that on the that like he's working in a restaurant?

SPEAKER_06 49:50

He was working in a restaurant on that part, actually. But yeah, the part where Vash recites his whole name, and I am not going to remember it, but like V-A-S-H, I guess, stands for something. You can look up Vash's full name and you'll find Johnny Youngbosh's voice actor just saying the whole thing. It's it's pretty funny, and there's yeah, there's nothing quite like it. But another thing I wanted to say about Vash is that, yeah, I think we talked about how Vash basically has no thought for himself. In Stampede, he screams, I don't care what happens to me. Like they'll if people hurt me, if they fight me, and I'll I'll just keep running, but I'll always come back. I'll always come back to them. And in the old one, with that little girl Lena, or that I don't know, teenage girl, who was disguised as a boy kind of, uh, to protect herself, there were some guys who were like trying to assault her. And Vash comes out and he pleads with them to leave her alone, and they're like, Here, how about we'll leave her alone if you strip naked and act like a dog? And they say that because they're like no one in their right mind would do that, and he does without a second thought. And everyone is like, Don't do this, like don't do this to yourself. But and it doesn't work because they just shoot him anyway, and then Vash has to get medical attention, although thankfully bullets don't usually kill him. Yeah, throughout the series, um bullets don't usually kill him. Okay, I guess that line didn't make sense. I I screwed up there. But would you say if you were getting tortured, like actually, would you think it's an appropriate time to start talking about how people can change and how people can change for the better and how good people can actually be. That's not really a a moment where you would be thinking about that. And yet that's what Vash does, and this is actually in the new one. Knives is actually has Legato constricting no contorting Vash's body in horrible ways and like breaking all his bones. And while he's doing that, Vash starts talking like, you know, people will surprise you. And they can grow. And Knives is like, you know, all this is irrelevant because of how long that would take, even if that was true, and meanwhile we're all being infused here, and la da la da da. And Vash is saying No, okay, so the cycle of cycle of violence can only be named by those who have felt it. Who have felt the pain. So that's you and me. He says, but do we continue the cycle or do we change? Because if you continue the cycle, you're just letting Tesla's death be another horrible act in that cycle. Or do you want to use that as a catalyst for change? And of course Nives is like, you're still as stupid as ever, screw you, and turns away. But watching Vashlik like being contorted and twisted and and breaking, and then with the most serious and genuine expression on his face, saying, like, people will surprise you. It's really It's powerful stuff. Rare to see something like that, and it's it's pretty gut-wrenching and beautiful. So as for why, and yes, I agree with you, the old one is better. As for why I think it's better. I think it's a lot of things, including tone, the tone difference. Like, I don't think it being super edgy. The vibe is different. Necessar needs to be the case. Like, I don't think it's bad, but I like Trigun when it's like kind of more uh lighthearted and then the dark stuff happens and it's more shocking instead of just dark stuff happening all the time. Like, I don't know if we need that, because then it's not really building up to it, it's just always there, and then it's kind of depressing. And it's less shocking, the shock kind of wears off. I know my husband actually said he thought Dragon Stampede was too sad and he wouldn't watch it again, but he thought the old Trigun was really good and he would watch that again. So, and he he actually said that Stamp he said the Stampede was good. It was just too too heartbreaking. Like watching, you know, Vash like like scream in that memory of him and Ram and stuff, but he he was like, Oh, I can't this is Heck no. Yeah, this is a bit too much, like this is everything just feels hopeless. Yeah, the tone, the characters, again, you can't really have Trigon without Marilyn Milley, I think, or it's not the same, not even close. And then just everyone is more funny, the characters are more enduring in the old one. And which is why I think I'll take that DVD set and re-watch it until I'm a hundred, because it is super, super good. I think Stamp Feed has some good things going for it. Uh it has some really good scenes like the one I mentioned, and Vash is still Vash. I think the biggest thing it has going for it is the action scenes are phenomenal in the new one.

SPEAKER_00 54:51

Stunning.

SPEAKER_06 54:52

I don't want to say they put the old one to shame because the old one is still good, but it's it doesn't have the technology to really compete with the depth and the really cool shots uh that that are in the new one. And also Knives is much more fleshed out in the new one. I used to like him in the old one, but he's barely in it in comparison to the new one. So I almost wish you could like combine some of those things, but I still say the old one is better at the end of the day. Yeah, and that seems like that's usually the pattern we're going on this show, is like the book is better or the original is better, but who knows, maybe we'll find something. Oh, we'll find one in the future that's we'll find something where the the newer one is better in the future because I believe in inequality now. Sounded so cringe. Anyways, I was gonna attempt to do an outro this time um for the TailTrail Podcast. We actually have a YouTube channel. It's I think it's the TailTrail underscore podcast.

SPEAKER_00 55:54

Yeah, it's at uh tailtrail underscore podcast.

SPEAKER_06 55:58

No, the at tailtrail underscore podcast. And we also have a Discord server which is slowly growing, and it's a place where you can submit ideas or you can talk about the episode, or you can talk about anything really. Uh, mostly people who are movie nerds and stuff like that on there. It's called the TailTrail server, and uh I should be able to give you uh an invite. Uh the link is in the YouTube description. And you can also follow me at charose49, that's s-h-a-r-o-se 49 on Instagram because that is my Instagram account, which I use to promote all my work, and since I don't post enough, I th thought it would be better to just post the Tailtrail podcast stuff onto that page to give me an excuse to post more. Because if I just had a page only for promoting the Tailtrail podcast, I probably would hardly ever upload anything to it. So yeah, so those are the places you can go to find us elsewhere. Uh but in the meantime, yeah, you can follow us on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts, except for iHeartRadio. I didn't like that one, but you have to make an account. And there's ads that I didn't like. Anyways, that about does it for this episode. We finally wrapped up the Try Gun discussion. It only took forever.

SPEAKER_02 57:23

Let's go.

SPEAKER_06 57:26

But until next time, you want to say it, Lyndon, this world is made? Repeat after me. This world is made of I'll say.

SPEAKER_02 57:35

This world is made of love and peace.

SPEAKER_06 57:38

Cheers.